Topic started by Shakthiprabha. on Tue Mar 20 0:42:25 2007.

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• From: Shakthiprabha on Sun Aug 30 9:31:51 2009.

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  pradheep wrote:

  Quote: I mean, could one die in 2040 AD and be born in 1450 AD ? Yes, in the sense of choices. Karma is a bundle of intensions and choices and manifestations. So if one dies in 2040 AD and is reborn in 1450 AD , it is the intensions and choices that determine the life there. If the intension is felt as going back (reversing) to 1450 AD , then naturally the karmic events before 1450 AD would dictate the events then. However, if the intension is to use the imprints from 2040 AD to a time of 1450 AD, then that dictates the events folding there. I hope I expressed the point clear.

  
  
  How is this possible pradheep? unless until we subscribe to the parellel universe concept not necessarily time machine !
  
  if 2040 can impact 1450, then 1450 then (or now) wont have the 1450 replay again. Things change and events change (to a particular molecular being) as the karmic impressions has changed. so 1450 is not 1450 but "1450 with 2040's effect" ????
  
  

• From: Shakthiprabha on Sun Aug 30 9:34:43 2009.

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  pradheep wrote:

  Quote: It curves and bends, and sometimes it bends over itself . Dear Ak What Modern scienctist forget heisenberg's principle and QM, that an electron is at all possibilities of exitence, but only when the observer is there it occupies an position. At macro level the observer's power is weakened by the strong collective forces of gravity, EM etc. But at the micro level the Observer's power is strong, which ultimately manifest at the macro level. This has relevance to you very interesting question.

  
  
  Please explain in "lay-man's" words I could not understand ANYTHING.
  
  

• From: Shakthiprabha on Sun Aug 30 9:38:58 2009.

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  pradheep wrote:

  Dear Ak To help explain the birth rebirth concepts, let me explain the basic laws. What caused birth. Desire only caused birth. Why human body, birth of anything is based on desire only. What made cars to be born?. Desire to travel without limitations. Nothing is being born in this universe without desire. But there is a catch in that. With expression of desire of birth comes all the packages, which a normal mind wont grasp. For example, with desire to create car, human mind did not perceive the problems of pollution etc.

  
  
  good.
  
  

  Quote:

  The first vibration at the micro level of Energy "I", gave rise to particle with highest energy frequency, which evolved (Big bang) to galaxies and stars and with that that original vibration has multiplied to trillions of "I" vibrations. Then that lead to micro-organisms on earth, then plants, animals and human.

  
  
  before "big bang" wasn't therez any "FIRST" event at all there was big bang...and then there were things BEFORE bigbang....and before...and after... and ALL THESE makes no sense when therez no "first" to anything so where does "first vibration" COME? Like prasad said, its beyond us to understand the secrets of nature?
  
  This is like "chicken-n-egg" story. First vibs came from previous vibs (assuming) but where did previous come.... I supp we may remember vishnu and brahma trying to "find the source and finality" of shiva and FAILED so the terim "first-vibration" "first big bang" ...
  
  "TIME (as we call it now) is... beginningless" is it not?
  
  

• From: Shakthiprabha on Sun Aug 30 9:43:34 2009.

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  pradheep wrote:

  Human form is very unique because there is a inbuilt mechanism to get back to the Source (Brahman). In human birth is also unique that, the I ego can manifest to its extreme end or can be diminished to zero level. For all its manifestation it need energy.

  
  
  So beautifully put
  
  

  Quote:

  The human mind then instead of decreasing the thought patterns keep increasing it. It is like going to a supermarket. You went only with a desire to buy 3 items in your list. When you saw many things there out of desire you brought 10 things. If you had money you buy with ready cash or you get it in credit card. The more you go to market the more you visits, to return it or to exchange it or to upgrade it.

  
  
  perfect
  
  

• From: anbu_kathir on Sun Aug 30 10:26:46 2009.

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  pradheep wrote:

  What caused birth. Desire only caused birth.

  
  
  Yes.. I guess so. But's its rather interesting to think about the first microorganism(s) that came into being. On that level, chemistry, physics is all that mattered. 'Desire' seems to be a natural thing, at least for the micro-orgs, where it is seemingly manifested to a large extent as purely scientific phenomena.. molecules attracting molecules for stability.
  
  

  pradheep wrote:

  Human form is very unique because there is a inbuilt mechanism to get back to the Source (Brahman). In human birth is also unique that, the I ego can manifest to its extreme end or can be diminished to zero level.

  
  
  So many religious and spiritual people have said humans are the only one to have this ability, but I refuse to accept it. IMHO we cannot make any opinion about the enlightenment (or ability to be enlightened) of another human being, let alone animals and plants. Plants and animals are unique for their own reasons, but the superiority (for lack of a better word) associated with humans is uncalled for. Who knows.. we might be the only species on earth that is not yet 'enlightened' ? I don't believe anyone can say anything about this for sure.
  
  Love and Light.
  
  

• From: pradheep on Mon Aug 31 17:47:19 2009.

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  Dear Sk
  

  Quote:

  How is this possible pradheep?

  
  I will come to the 1450 and 2040 explanation later because understanding other facts would nail it down easily.
  

  Quote:

  Please explain in "lay-man's" words

  
  When atom was split and found to have electrons, the scientists put the model that electrons were spinning around nucleus in orbits like Earth around Sun. Then Quantum mechainics proved it was wrong. Electron did not go around, but the electrons could exists in many probabilities around the nucleus. The probability is influenced by the observer, which when heisenbergy said, scientists could not beleive. But look at the most recent one
  http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/1998/02/980227055013.htm
  
  So when the matter (electron) is at micro level, observer effect seems to be more pronounced, that the observer effect influencing at macro bodies like a star. This is why effects of thoughts affect other thoughts (micro) more than thoughts affecting body (macro).
  
  Do I need to simplify further?
  
  

  Quote:

  so where does "first vibration" COME?

  
  
  The first thought "I" from the most subtlest energy, which we call as Aadhi-Paraa-sakthi. That is not a lady with a red color sari as people think, it is the symbolic of the most subtlest energy vibration, which we call as a thought (subtlest thought vibration which is not a thought like that produced in a brain).
  
  TIME (as we call it now) is... beginningless" is it not?
  When there are two objects (forms) time and Space come into picture and not in singularity.
  
  Dear AK
  

  Quote:

  manifested to a large extent as purely scientific phenomena

  why only Micro-org's, even our body phenomena is also physical bio-chemistry.
  
  

  Quote:

  about the enlightenment

  Can you please explain what you mean by enlightenment .
  
  

• From: anbu_kathir on Tue Sep 1 4:28:37 2009.

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  pradheep wrote:

  why only Micro-org's, even our body phenomena is also physical bio-chemistry.

  
  
  What I meant was that 'scientific' structure of Life is a bit more evident in micro-organisms than in the human body. They do not 'seem' to have complicated emotions and all those additional desires over the most basic... so they are a bit more closer to machines than a human, although surely not 100% so.
  
  

  pradheep wrote:

  Can you please explain what you mean by enlightenment .

  
  
  I don't think I know or can explain what it means, but I think of it as 'That (state) which cannot be explained by concepts', because I think this is a fair pointer to reality.
  
  Love and Light.
  
  

• From: pradheep on Tue Sep 1 12:07:26 2009.

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  Quote:

  because I think this is a fair pointer to reality.

  
  Dear AK
  Thats correct it cannot be explained. But it can be pointed that it is the state of the source of all manifestations. In reality we are all enligtened, but we dont know it because of the curtain of Ego in front of us. Once the curtain is removed we become aware of our awareness. In plants animals and micro-organisms, the Curtain is thin, but still there, but they dont have the means or knwledge to remove it. In Human we know the problems and means to overcome it.
  
  

• From: anbu_kathir on Wed Sep 2 7:10:55 2009.

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  pradheep wrote:

  Quote: because I think this is a fair pointer to reality. Dear AK Thats correct it cannot be explained. But it can be pointed that it is the state of the source of all manifestations. In reality we are all enligtened, but we dont know it because of the curtain of Ego in front of us. Once the curtain is removed we become aware of our awareness. In plants animals and micro-organisms, the Curtain is thin, but still there, but they dont have the means or knwledge to remove it. In Human we know the problems and means to overcome it.

  
  
  My point was that we cannot make such a statement about them. How can one say for sure?
  
  Love and Light.
  
  

• From: pradheep on Wed Sep 2 10:37:23 2009.

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  Quote:

  How can one say for sure?

  
  Dear AK
  It could be an indirect guessing only based on Evolutionary theory both at Physical sciences and in spiritual level. Based on Evolution the lower one's would not have an ability that the higher one have developed. Same with Spiritual evolution. With this thought only one can say they will not have it. However exception are there. Hope you have heard of Guruvayoor Kesavan an elephant. Though there were 100's of elephants , only his behavior was different. All elephants bend down all four legs all times for human to get on its back. Kesavan would bend only all four legs when the Lord's statue was there, otherwise it will only bend its hind legs only.
  http://www.guruvayurdevaswom.org/kesavan.shtmlKesavan would stay calm only when he was given the bananas from the Lord. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guruvayur_Keshavan
  
  These show that an animal had a spiritual inclination. I said the generalized picture based on spiritual and material evolution point of view.
  
  

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